Is this enough Policy for you?

Many Clinton supporters here at MYDD, and elsewhere, have parroted two talking points that Clinton loves using against Obama.

1.) He is all rhetoric and no policy
2.) He lacks the experience necessary to lead

Read this speech, delivered today, regarding our policies and the War in Iraq.

http://thepage.time.com/full-text-of-oba mas-iraq-speech/

If, after reading this speech you can honestly say that you still buy the anti-Obama talking points than good for you. I would venture to say that anyone who can say that either hasn't read it or doesn't really care though. And that just isn't intellectually honest.

In this speech he covers policy in Iraq, policy in Afghanistan, the overarching "war on terror," American safety, and our place in the world.

He outlines, brilliantly, how withdrawal from Iraq, and the end of the war there, is the cornerstone to any meaningful change from our current situation. He discusses specifics regarding how, when, and why we must do the things we do. And he sets a firm date for the final combat troops leaving Iraq: 16 months after he assumes the mantle of President.

He also lays to rest the McCain argument that any of this would equal surrender. In my mind this puts an end to any argument over whether he is ready to be Commander in Chief. In fact, I will go a step further: he is the MOST ready of the three. He understands what we need to do and how we need to do it. He also understands why and what the long term effects will be.

A day after giving the most thought provoking speech I have heard in my lifetime he has shown us why he is ready to lead. Today I am very proud of the candidate I have chosen to support.



Display:


Re: Is this enough Policy for you? (1.50 / 2)

Words are not enough. They are however the most potent weapon he has at the moment.

No one Senator can bring our troops home. And arguing that he should have voted against funding is a bogus argument. We all knew that the war was going to be funded and we know we can't really stop funding it.

What Obama shows, with his words, is that he understands the situation, has the right judgment regarding it, and knows, "from day one," how to deal with it.

He is currently a candidate for the Presidency. Candidates give speeches, it is how they define their candidacy and what type of President they will be.

Also, based on your comment, I would assume you didn't even bother reading the speech; would should be considered a must read for anyone who is actually against the war.


I read the body count out of the paper; now it's written all over my face.
by JDF on Wed Mar 19, 2008 at 04:37:25 PM EST

Giving speeches is a large part of the job (1.66 / 3)

One of the most important powers of the presidency is the bully pulpit.  Say you're going to make a speech and every network will cover it.  If he needs pressure on Congress to get a bill passed, being able to make a persuasive speech goes a long way towards that.

Being able to convince people is important.  It's easy to forget that because Bush doesn't have the ability to sell air conditioners in Las Vegas.


Beat McCain!
by thezzyzx on Wed Mar 19, 2008 at 04:40:17 PM EST

Re: Giving speeches is a large part of the job (2.00 / 3)

Holy crap are you kidding?  Bush has been able to sell quite a lot of things to many people.  He did it with lies and asshatery but he did it nonetheless.  Being able to convince people to do things is not that special - it's being able to convince people to do the right things that is the real accomplishment.


by JustJennifer on Wed Mar 19, 2008 at 04:42:26 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Giving speeches is a large part of the job (none / 0)

Yeah, that has yet to be seen hasn't it?  


by JustJennifer on Wed Mar 19, 2008 at 04:47:10 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Giving speeches is a large part of the job (none / 0)

He's getting people to come out and vote Democrat...I'd say that's a start, and should the Dems build on their majorities (especially in the Senate) then it will go a LONG way toward helping either him or Hillary come next January.


Donate to Obama, Today!
by freedom78 on Wed Mar 19, 2008 at 04:55:51 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Giving speeches is a large part of the job (none / 0)

Its not just that somehow (and I still think it has to be image management) the wingnuts react to him like we do to Bill Clinton or Barack Obama, they genuinely see him as this charismatic cowboy, I don't get it, I mean I could kind of get him getting the "machismo" pt vs. Gore, but Kerry was a fucking badass, I mean his last citation (and the one even the swiftboats didn't question; seriously the Swifities actually backed him up on this one-- probably because it saved one of the main dudes lives but I digress) he beached a River boat at full speed jumped off with an M 16 and took out some guy with a RPG and yet somehow he lost to a fricking cheerleader I mean how the hell does Kerry come out of that matchup seeming effeminate and Bush this Eastwoodesque stud?!


by Socraticsilence on Wed Mar 19, 2008 at 05:49:14 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Is this enough Policy for you? (2.00 / 3)

Hillary gave a speech on Iraq on Monday

http://www.hillaryclinton.com/news/speec h/view/?id=6553

What's your point?  The candidates are giving speeches?


by JustJennifer on Wed Mar 19, 2008 at 04:40:58 PM EST

Re: Is this enough Policy for you? (none / 0)

My point is that HIS speech puts to rest the "empty suit" meme.

It shows where he is coming from in terms of Foreign Policy


I read the body count out of the paper; now it's written all over my face.
by JDF on Wed Mar 19, 2008 at 05:02:59 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Is this enough Policy for you? (1.00 / 1)

On Iraq, he gave a beautiful speech in 2002 against war.

He gave many speeches in opposition to the war. He ran a campaign on opposition to the war. So drop the "one speech" talking point please.

Obama had the opportunity to use his brilliant oratory to become a leading opponent of the war once he actually got elected to Congress.
\
No Freshman Senator, no matter how popular, is going to march into the Senate and start dictating policy. There is a complex web of seniority that makes sure Freshman don't lead policy. He could have stuck his neck out, with no support, but all that would have done is earn him the contempt of his fellow Congressional Democrats and give fuel to the Right during his presidential bid. He would have been constantly accused of "not funding the troops" and it would have ruined his chances. Instead, he waited until the rest of the Dems came around before he started voting to "defund the troops". It was the only prudent course of action he could take.

Obama is a wonderful speaker.

Did you read the diary? The diarist's whole point is that this ridiculous meme, that Obama is nothing but a good speaker, is pure BS.

What has he actually done, in terms of deeds and actions, to tackle race relations?

Try looking into his record (a novel idea, I know). He passed many laws in the state legislature that directly impact the livelihood of racial minorities. Like police tracking to protect against racial profiling. And surveillance of police interrogations.

If you want to argue based on the reality of his policies and his record, fine. But all you did was repeat as many anti-Obama talking points as you could fit into one post.


www.thingsyoungerthanmccain.com
by LandStander on Wed Mar 19, 2008 at 04:42:57 PM EST

Re: Is this enough Policy for you? (none / 0)

This is still a speech. Unlike the Clinton campaign he has not come up with any printed plan. Unlike the Clinton campaign his healthcare reform falls far short (in fact he now uses Republican talking points to criticize the Clinton plan). He has no plan for the economy or the foreclosure mess. It is all one bombastic speech meant for gullible people. I am frankly sick and tried of intellectually dishonest posts like this. Show me a policy paper not a speech which he can disavow at a moment's notice.


by tarheel74 on Wed Mar 19, 2008 at 05:03:26 PM EST

Re: Is this enough Policy for you? (none / 0)

He laid out his plan, in detail, in a public forum.

Do not accuse of me intellectually dishonesty, especially if you are going to ignore the premise of my diary and use it as forum to discuss things that are in no way related.

Oh, and if you want printed policy stances go to his website.

My guess is that there is nothing he could say or do that would please you and you do not bother reading any of it anyway.


I read the body count out of the paper; now it's written all over my face.
by JDF on Wed Mar 19, 2008 at 05:13:58 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Is this enough Policy for you? (none / 0)

Have you, uh, looked for his "printed plan"?  Try his campaign website.

Ummm, healthcare reform falls short?

Right.  Both candidates healthcare plans are nearly identical.

You're sick and tired of intellectually dishonest posts?  Wow, preview must have been tough for you to get through, eh?


Unseen, in the background, Fate was quietly slipping the lead into the boxing glove.
by fogiv on Wed Mar 19, 2008 at 05:16:42 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Is this enough Policy for you? (2.00 / 1)

no Sen. Clinton's healthcare plan is far superior and mandates universal health coverage, Obama's does not...that is a fact.


by tarheel74 on Wed Mar 19, 2008 at 05:37:42 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Is this enough Policy for you? (none / 0)

One mandates, the other subsidizes.  Other than that:  SAME.

So her "mandate" makes her plan "far" superior.  Please explain how.  I'm very open to hering your thoughts on the subject.

Have we settled the "printed plan" matter then?


Unseen, in the background, Fate was quietly slipping the lead into the boxing glove.
by fogiv on Wed Mar 19, 2008 at 05:41:27 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Is this enough Policy for you? (none / 0)

What actions against the war has he demonstrated since then?

Since the speech in 2002, he has:

*Publicly opposed the war while campaigning in both 2003 and 2004.

*Called for a phased withdrawl of troops in 2005.

*In 2006 he called for policital reconcilliation in Iraq, again called for withdrawl, and advocated for agressive diplomacy in the region.

*In January 2007, he introduced legislation in the Senate to remove all of our combat troops from Iraq by March 2008.

*In September 2007, he laid out a detailed plan for how he will end the war as president.

Now, what has HRC done to end the war in Iraq (apart from authorizing it)?

Well, she made these strong anti-war statements:

"I can support the President, I can support an action against Saddam Hussein because I think it's in the long-term interests of our national security." (NBC's Meet The Press, 9/15/02)

"In the four years since the inspectors left, intelligence reports show that Saddam Hussein has worked to rebuild his chemical and biological weapons stock. His missile delivery capability, his nuclear program. He has also given aid, comfort, and sanctuary to terrorists including Al-Qaeda members. It is clear, however, that if left unchecked, Saddam Hussein will continue to increase his capacity to wage biological and chemical warfare and will keep trying to develop nuclear weapons."  (Senator Hillary Clinton, October 10, 2002)

I voted for the Iraqi resolution. I consider the prospect of a nuclear-armed Saddam Hussein who can threaten not only his neighbors but the stability of the region and the world, a very serious threat to the United States." (Hillary Clinton - January 22, 2003)


Unseen, in the background, Fate was quietly slipping the lead into the boxing glove.
by fogiv on Wed Mar 19, 2008 at 05:04:18 PM EST

Re: Is this enough Policy for you? (none / 0)

Just asking..those of whom support Hillary on Iraq..
did you/will attend a gathering of people opposed to this madness in your local area today/tonight?
Didn't think so.
"If you want to end war and stuff, you gotta sing loud"...Arlo Guthrie
by nogo war on Wed Mar 19, 2008 at 05:09:27 PM EST

Re: Is this enough Policy for you? (2.00 / 1)

This speech is unfortunately more an attack on Hillary Clinton, classifying her with Bush and McCain, than much of a substantive policy speech. I think his earlier foreign policy speeches, which cover the same ground with more substance, are much better:
August 2007, the war we need to win
April 2007, Chicago Council on Global Affairs

But most of what he has to say was anticipated, in much more depth, by Hillary Clinton in October 2006 at the CFR.


by souvarine on Wed Mar 19, 2008 at 05:18:56 PM EST

Re: Is this enough Policy for you? (none / 0)

Am I the only who just saw confirmation on CNN of the story that's been going around for a while: the reason that the surge is "working" is that were paying militias like $10 mil a week? Seriously, it like claiming a War on the Mob is working bwecause your paying for protection. I'm getting a bit owrried McCain's going to win because of the surge, this will be his framing strategy and frankly I don't see a hugely credible counter for either Canidate (if US casualites remain low):
McCain- Risked his political career to call for the unpopular surge, that saved Iraq and gave us Peace with Honor

HRC- Supported the War until it became politically inconveniet to do so (ties into her metanarrative-- will do anything to win, has no integrity)

Obama- Against the War from the start... because he's too naive to realize Saddam's links to 9-11 (remember 2004 showed facts don't matter ) fits into his metanarrative, weak, naive, not proud of America)

At this point other than a Joint ticket win with sheer demographics (also accomplished by taking Richardson for either of them), or possibly a counter with a general as VP (Zinni for Obama, for CENTCOM commander-- in cahrge of Mid East Operations just prior to invasion, opposed all the way, Zinni's downside is sadly that he is a I believe of Arab descent, and despite his service will thus be called unpatriotic) (Clark for Clinton- Allied Commander Europe, led in Kosovo- though this could be a detractor depending on spin).


by Socraticsilence on Wed Mar 19, 2008 at 06:00:28 PM EST


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